<p dir="ltr">+1 Nick </p>
<p dir="ltr">Michael, the paper you sent (BTW, really bad form to copy the whole thing rather than providing a link, for far more reasons than mobile devices) strikes me as a backgrounder. Its relevance *here* strikes me as peripheral unless you wish to argue that Google is not a legitimate stakeholder.</p>
<p dir="ltr">If not that, then what is the action point you wish to raise *here* as result of the piece. "Fear Google" is in itself insufficient IMO, but I genuinely want to know how you would have this group react. </p>
<p dir="ltr">Netmundial, arguably a significant 1Net milestone, demonstrated that it is possible to include very large, very invasive and very fear-worthy actors in the process. Furthermore, in a rough consensus model, no one player has a veto.</p>
<p dir="ltr">Are you suggesting that Google requires different treatment? <br>
</p>
<div class="gmail_quote">On May 3, 2014 5:00 AM, "michael gurstein" <<a href="mailto:gurstein@gmail.com">gurstein@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br type="attribution"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Nick,<br>
<br>
I would have thought putting these discussions into an appropriate, current<br>
and larger context would be a quite reasonable addition--although clearly<br>
uncomfortable for some.<br>
<br>
But yes, apologies to those following on mobiles.<br>
<br>
M<br>
<br>
-----Original Message-----<br>
From: Nick Ashton-Hart [mailto:<a href="mailto:nashton@internet-ecosystem.org">nashton@internet-ecosystem.org</a>]<br>
Sent: Saturday, May 03, 2014 9:37 AM<br>
To: michael gurstein<br>
Cc: <a href="mailto:discuss@1net.org">discuss@1net.org</a> List<br>
Subject: Re: [bestbits] Shoshanna Zuboff: Dark Google<br>
<br>
- all the double posting.<br>
<br>
Michael, I'm a European, and in addition I actually live in Europe. What's<br>
roiling Europe right now is the Ukraine crisis - not this stuff.<br>
<br>
Could I ask - once again - that we try to keep /1net discussions focussed<br>
how to collaborate on issues where there's a possibility of (1) all<br>
communities actually seeing there is an issue, and (2) through dialogue<br>
agreeing on some common points about that issue?<br>
<br>
I think I'm on very safe ground in saying that this entire meme does not<br>
meet either of those conditions.<br>
<br>
Could I also ask that entire long articles from publications not be copied<br>
wholesale into list correspondence? While I am not, some people are paying<br>
for mobile access to this list, and this simply increases their costs and<br>
downloading time for communications. A link should suffice.<br>
<br>
On 3 May 2014, at 09:55, michael gurstein <<a href="mailto:gurstein@gmail.com">gurstein@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
> This discussion is currently roiling Europe and beyond.<br>
><br>
> The discussion and Zuboff's analysis has very significant implications for<br>
the matters of Multistakeholder governance which are currently being<br>
triumphantly trumpeted in these contexts and beyond. The issues that Zuboff<br>
is pointing to with specific reference to Google and surveillance underlie<br>
the drive to include companies like Google and others directly in decision<br>
making through multistakeholder processes/Internet Governance.<br>
><br>
> It hardly takes a huge flight of imagination to recognize the signals<br>
concerning the extreme danger that MSism represents in the context of<br>
Zuboff's arguments i.e. giving Google (et al) effective veto power over and<br>
a highly influential (and potentially unstoppable role in) decision making<br>
in areas key to controlling what Zuboff calls "the rise of absolute power".<br>
><br>
> (And for the Multistakeholderists among us here is a critical response<br>
> from a former senior employee of another Silicon Valley corporate<br>
> giant--Yahoo<br>
> <a href="https://www.facebook.com/benjaminbratton/posts/10152082644097966?strea" target="_blank">https://www.facebook.com/benjaminbratton/posts/10152082644097966?strea</a><br>
> m_ref=10 )<br>
><br>
> M<br>
><br>
> -----Original Message-----<br>
> From: liberationtech<br>
> [mailto:<a href="mailto:liberationtech-bounces@lists.stanford.edu">liberationtech-bounces@lists.stanford.edu</a>] On Behalf Of Yosem<br>
> Companys<br>
> Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2014 4:41 PM<br>
> To: Liberation Technologies<br>
> Subject: [liberationtech] Shoshanna Zuboff: Dark Google<br>
><br>
<br>
<Snip> the rest of a gigantically long reproduction of an article.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
--<br>
Regards,<br>
<br>
Nick Ashton-Hart<br>
Executive Director, Internet & Digital Ecosystem Alliance (IDEA)<br>
Tel: <a href="tel:%2B41%20%2822%29%20534%2099%2045" value="+41225349945">+41 (22) 534 99 45</a><br>
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Skype: nashtonhart<br>
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<br>
<br>
<br>
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</blockquote></div>