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<font face="Verdana">For an global IG discussion, the operative part
in the <a
href="http://www.timesofisrael.com/israeli-us-terror-victims-now-own-irans-internet/">news
story</a> is this<br>
<br>
"</font><font face="Verdana">The United State District Court
decided that the<span id="e2bd3055-f21f-4730-a26a-1903f35c4152"
class="GINGER_SOFTWARE_mark"> .ir</span> domain name, along with
Iran’s IP addresses ..... were assets that could be seized to
satisfy judgments (of US courts)....". <br>
<br>
I dont see on what basis can this point of law be struck down by
an higher court... It is kind of obvious. Has always been obvious.
The news story is just being cited to try to force the obvious on
those who are so thoroughly intent on not seeing the obvious :)<br>
<br>
parminder<br>
</font>
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border: medium none;"><br>
Read more: <a style="color: #003399;"
href="http://www.timesofisrael.com/israeli-us-terror-victims-now-own-irans-internet/#ixzz35pr9cHtn">Israeli,
US terror victims could 'own' Iran's Internet | The Times of
Israel</a> <a style="color: #003399;"
href="http://www.timesofisrael.com/israeli-us-terror-victims-now-own-irans-internet/#ixzz35pr9cHtn">http://www.timesofisrael.com/israeli-us-terror-victims-now-own-irans-internet/#ixzz35pr9cHtn</a>
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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On Friday 27 June 2014 04:08 PM,
parminder wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote cite="mid:53AD49B8.9000003@itforchange.net" type="cite">
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<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On Friday 27 June 2014 03:34 PM, Nick
Ashton-Hart wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:8F20C6C3-1E28-406C-9B3D-E3A5CC5D285B@internet-ecosystem.org"
type="cite">
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charset=ISO-8859-1">
- the double posting for real this time.
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I'm sorry Parminder, but this case has nothing to do with
the point you are making. The court - and the plaintiff's
solicitor - simply don't understand that a ccTLD and ICANN
don't exchange money, ICANN doesn't license them or anything
of the sort. This is a non-enforceable judgment based upon
flawed information at a very fundamental level.<br>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
Nick<br>
<br>
The basic issue is that the US courts, at all levels, from the
lowest onwards, have full jurisdiction over ICANN - its
activities, assets, relationships, finances and so on. This is of
course quite evident without having to go through the papers of
this case, or a few others that US courts have picked up reg ICANN
(like the one on whether .xxx is compatible with commerce related
laws of the US). This case simply further highlights the obvious
control that the US jurisdiction and law has over the ICANN, in
all respects, and fully. Whether cctld makes no payment is a minor
point - an Iran based gtld, which does make payments, could be in
the 'accused box' on some other issue.... <br>
<br>
In a recent write up, I used the example of, say, a private gtld
of an Indian company which sells generic drugs. Lets call it dot
genricdrugs... Its business may be completely legitimate in India
and most of the world, but lets say a US pharma takes its business
model to a US court, and the court finds it running foul of the
stupidly severe US IP protections, and similarly, as in the quoted
case, asks ICANN to seize both the payments made to ICANN as well
as possibly the gltd from the root server itself. I consider this
not only very plausible but a round the corner scenario. Can you
show me how this is not possible. Why should Indian companies and
citizens be at the mercy of US law and institutions? That is the
point. And that point is rather strongly accentuated by the court
judgement being discussed currently, whether in its specific
elements it is enforceable or not. <br>
<br>
As you can perhaps well judge, no one here is interested in the
specfic subject of this judgement, but on the very important
global Internet governance issue that it raises. And this issue
goes to the heart of ICANN oversight transition issue. ICANN
oversight is foremost about figuring out the legitimate political
domain that it should be anchored in and responsible to... But of
course we can put aside such real issues and sink back again into
the comfort zone of all the ICANN-ic trivialities that IMHO have
filled up the ICANN oversight transition discussion. <br>
<br>
parminder <br>
<br>
<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:8F20C6C3-1E28-406C-9B3D-E3A5CC5D285B@internet-ecosystem.org"
type="cite">
<div> <br>
<div>
<div>On 27 Jun 2014, at 11:53, parminder <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:parminder@itforchange.net">parminder@itforchange.net</a>>
wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<blockquote type="cite">
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http-equiv="Content-Type">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"> <font
face="Verdana">Many of us have been saying for years
now that ICANN as a global governance body is simply
not sustainable to remain under US jurisdiction, and
must be incorporated under international law with host
country immunities.... And we have said a thousand
times that it is not just the issue of what the US
executive decides, but also what any court in US could
decide any day on any issue, which could unravel the
whole structure and its plausibility.... Sorry for the
'I told you so' sentiment, but well, we need to wake
up. Even now.... parminder<br>
<br>
<br>
</font>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On Friday 27 June 2014
02:54 PM, Bill Woodcock wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:739FF646-63A2-49C3-A00F-3D79F508B3EE@pch.net"
type="cite">
<pre wrap="">On Jun 27, 2014, at 2:22 AM, michael gurstein <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:gurstein@gmail.com"><gurstein@gmail.com></a> wrote:
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap=""><a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.timesofisrael.com/israeli-us-terror-victims-now-own-irans-internet/">http://www.timesofisrael.com/israeli-us-terror-victims-now-own-irans-internet/</a>
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">For those not following on NANOG:
<a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://freebeacon.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/Subpoena-Ben-Haim-02-1611-with-Schedule-A.pdf">http://freebeacon.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/Subpoena-Ben-Haim-02-1611-with-Schedule-A.pdf</a>
-Bill
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