<div dir="auto">Agreed!<br><br><div data-smartmail="gmail_signature">Carlos Raúl GUTIERREZ<br>Apartado 1571-1000<br>San José COSTA RICA</div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Sep 4, 2017 06:01, "Carlos Afonso" <<a href="mailto:ca@cafonso.ca">ca@cafonso.ca</a>> wrote:<br type="attribution"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">While the list is still alive... Hola tocayo,<br>
<br>
Allow me to agree with you on the qauality of the work done in<br>
NETmundial, and disagree on a possible follow-up process.<br>
<br>
The idea of a NETmundial follow-up is not to rewrite the whole thing,<br>
but to assess how the recommended principles and the roadmap are doing.<br>
The road we are talking about is not static like a highway, it is<br>
subject to significant and more or less rapid changes, with new key<br>
issues emerging. I understand this is the idea Wolf has been defending.<br>
<br>
Did we talk about ransomware, the blockchain or IoT in NETmundial, for<br>
example? A full-text search of the event repository finds nothing on<br>
these -- except for a single occurrence of the word "idiots" in a<br>
personal message :-)<br>
<br>
So I am in favor of a NETmundial+5 assessment event (and preparatory<br>
process), I do hope we may be able to count on CGI.br to help us on this<br>
(realistic pessimism aside), and I do not think it will need to cost as<br>
much as the original event.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
On 03/09/2017 03:32, Carlos Raul Gutierrez wrote:<br>
> Dear Ian,<br>
><br>
> Netmundial produced a Roadmap that does not need a new confenrence. It<br>
> just needs to be read and acted upon. The copyright is not held by the<br>
> Brazilian government either. In fact is not held by any Government<br>
> and/or the World Economic Forum (anymore)<br>
><br>
> Particularly today, when many members of Icann are looking for an<br>
> appropriate framework for their interest and efforts beyond ICANNs<br>
> narrow remit, a Sunday reading of the suscint NetMundial document could<br>
> be a most useful place to look for new fresh ideas of cooperation as far<br>
> away from the UN and it's member Governments as possible, assuming we<br>
> can forgive and forget about any old parenthood claims and missguided<br>
> efforts to coopt the NetMundial effort.<br>
><br>
> In my view it is still one of the best, most efficiently produced<br>
> bottom-up multistakeholder IG policy document I have come across.<br>
><br>
> Maybe as Marylin just said, moving it to a new second level domain could<br>
> be a very a ver worthwhile exercise before biting it as Olivier suggested.<br>
><br>
> Carlos Raúl GUTIERREZ<br>
> Apartado 1571-1000<br>
> San José COSTA RICA<br>
><br>
> On Sep 2, 2017 23:41, "Ian Peter" <<a href="mailto:ian.peter@ianpeter.com">ian.peter@ianpeter.com</a><br>
> <mailto:<a href="mailto:ian.peter@ianpeter.com">ian.peter@ianpeter.com</a><wbr>>> wrote:<br>
><br>
>Â Â Â Thanks Seun for raising this possibility. Unfortunately I have to<br>
>Â Â Â report that the revised Netmundial Initiative is now dormant, for a<br>
>Â Â Â number of reasons; one of which was a change of government in Brazil<br>
>Â Â Â which wanted to distance itself from any achievements of the<br>
>Â Â Â previous government; but there were many other reasons as well. And<br>
>Â Â Â although some of us think a second Netmundial Conference would be<br>
>   beneficial, I don’t know of any initiative to get this underway.<br>
><br>
>   But to also look at Olivier’s question: if this list is to be<br>
>Â Â Â disbanded, I do hope it is archived, because I think it does have<br>
>Â Â Â some unique historical significance. There are not many global<br>
>Â Â Â statements that deal with the range of issues confronting the<br>
>   Internet – and this one is the only one I know of which was<br>
>Â Â Â developed and adopted in a bottom-up multistakeholder fashion. So I<br>
>Â Â Â think what went on here was unique and should not be lost from the<br>
>Â Â Â historical record.<br>
><br>
>Â Â Â As regards any future; well, I must admit to a great deal of<br>
>Â Â Â frustration personally at the way some of the issues we discussed at<br>
>Â Â Â Netmundial have evolved since then. Personal data protection has<br>
>Â Â Â definitely got a lot worse, both from a surveillance point of view<br>
>Â Â Â and also as regards use of personal data for commercial purposes.<br>
>Â Â Â And anyone trying to address these issues,and particularly their<br>
>Â Â Â transboundary dimensions, seems confronted by a very cosy<br>
>Â Â Â relationship between large internet corporations and a few key large<br>
>   governments which seems to go along the lines of “give us easy<br>
>   access to your data for surveillance purposes, and we won’t regulate<br>
>   youâ€. Win-win for them, the rest of us are I believe losing some<br>
>Â Â Â fundamental rights to privacy and freedom of expression.<br>
><br>
>Â Â Â Some similar issues arise when we get to discuss cybersecurity and<br>
>Â Â Â cyberwarfare, to raise a couple of other issues. These are not being<br>
>Â Â Â addressed in a sensible manner, and I believe cannot be addressed<br>
>Â Â Â effectively without the sort of comprehensive multistakeholder<br>
>Â Â Â co-operation we saw at Netmundial.<br>
><br>
>Â Â Â So if this list fades, I hope some initiative gets underway to<br>
>Â Â Â address these issues and looks at cross-stakeholder discussion on<br>
>Â Â Â emerging issues in a world where nation state jurisdiction and the<br>
>Â Â Â power of global internet corporations are on a collision course<br>
>Â Â Â where nobody wins. I have just mentioned a few issues above, there<br>
>Â Â Â are many more where I believe some concerted action and co-operation<br>
>Â Â Â would be beneficial.<br>
><br>
>Â Â Â Ian Peter<br>
><br>
>Â Â Â PS Interested to know if anyone here has been stopped at US borders<br>
>Â Â Â and denied entry until they hand over their Facebook password? I<br>
>Â Â Â hear reports of this happening, and certainly an application for US<br>
>Â Â Â visa includes a (non-compulsory) question where you nominate the<br>
>Â Â Â details of your Facebook and Twitter accounts. Practices like this<br>
>Â Â Â are awful and should never become widespread.<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
>Â Â Â *From:* Seun Ojedeji<br>
>Â Â Â *Sent:* Sunday, September 3, 2017 12:45 PM<br>
>Â Â Â *To:* Marilyn Cade<br>
>Â Â Â *Cc:* discuss<br>
>   *Subject:* Re: [discuss] 💰I think I've found it!<br>
><br>
>Â Â Â Hello Marilyn, all<br>
><br>
>Â Â Â You raised an important question and my response will be... "perhaps<br>
>Â Â Â but what will that be"?<br>
><br>
>Â Â Â We had this discussion sometime last year and Ian made a few<br>
>Â Â Â points[1] one of them relating to a NetMundia in the making and I<br>
>Â Â Â wonder if that is still in the pipeline? Perhaps this list can come<br>
>Â Â Â alive again.<br>
><br>
>Â Â Â Regards<br>
>Â Â Â 1.<br>
>Â Â Â <a href="http://1net-mail.1net.org/pipermail/discuss/2016-April/005201.html" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://1net-mail.1net.org/<wbr>pipermail/discuss/2016-April/<wbr>005201.html</a><br>
>Â Â Â <<a href="http://1net-mail.1net.org/pipermail/discuss/2016-April/005201.html" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://1net-mail.1net.org/<wbr>pipermail/discuss/2016-April/<wbr>005201.html</a>><br>
>Â Â Â Sent from my mobile<br>
>Â Â Â Kindly excuse brevity and typos<br>
><br>
>Â Â Â On Sep 2, 2017 11:10 PM, "Marilyn Cade" <<a href="mailto:marilynscade@hotmail.com">marilynscade@hotmail.com</a>><br>
>Â Â Â wrote:<br>
><br>
>Â Â Â Â Â Or, should we repurpose this list? And make it meaningful again?<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
>Â Â Â Â Â M<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
>Â Â Â Â Â ------------------------------<wbr>------------------------------<wbr>------------<br>
>Â Â Â Â Â *From:* <a href="mailto:discuss-bounces@1net.org">discuss-bounces@1net.org</a> <<a href="mailto:discuss-bounces@1net.org">discuss-bounces@1net.org</a>> on<br>
>     behalf of Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond <<a href="mailto:ocl@gih.com">ocl@gih.com</a>><br>
>Â Â Â Â Â *Sent:* Saturday, September 2, 2017 5:54 PM<br>
>Â Â Â Â Â *To:* Peter H. Hellmonds<br>
>Â Â Â Â Â *Cc:* discuss<br>
>     *Subject:* Re: [discuss] 💰I think I've found it!<br>
><br>
>Â Â Â Â Â Dear Peter,<br>
><br>
>Â Â Â Â Â As with any retirement, I wonder about two questions:<br>
><br>
>Â Â Â Â Â 1. should this mailing list be archived? Is it a piece of<br>
>Â Â Â Â Â Internet history?<br>
>Â Â Â Â Â 2. is the <a href="http://1net.org" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">1net.org</a> <<a href="http://1net.org" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://1net.org</a>> domain & web site going to<br>
>Â Â Â Â Â be archived too, beyond <a href="http://archive.org" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">archive.org</a> <<a href="http://archive.org" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://archive.org</a>> ?<br>
><br>
>Â Â Â Â Â Warmest regards,<br>
><br>
>Â Â Â Â Â Olivier<br>
><br>
>Â Â Â Â Â On 02/09/2017 19:26, Peter H. Hellmonds wrote:<br>
>>     Looks like it’s time to give this list a rest. Other than<br>
>>Â Â Â Â Â faked mails with spam where all of us know they would never<br>
>>Â Â Â Â Â ever come from Patrik there seems to be no relevant traffic<br>
>>Â Â Â Â Â left here on the list. Unless some real human being tells me<br>
>>     there is a value to remain on this list, I’ll be out in a few<br>
>>Â Â Â Â Â days.<br>
>><br>
>>Â Â Â Â Â Cheers<br>
>>Â Â Â Â Â Peter<br>
>><br>
>>Â Â Â Â Â Peter H. Hellmonds<br>
>>Â Â Â Â Â <<a href="mailto:peter.hellmonds@hellmonds.eu">peter.hellmonds@hellmonds.eu</a>><br>
>>Â Â Â Â Â <a href="tel:%2B49%20160%20360%202852" value="+491603602852">+49 160 360 2852</a> <tel:+49%20160%203602852><br>
>><br>
>>Â Â Â Â Â On Aug 31, 2017, at 02:19, Harvey Moses <<a href="mailto:paf@frobbit.se">paf@frobbit.se</a>> wrote:<br>
>><br>
>>Â Â Â Â Â Yo!<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>>Â Â Â Â Â Please look into the products I've just found, I think that's<br>
>>Â Â Â Â Â what you were looking for. Take a look (phishing link removed)<br>
>><br>
>>     Yours sincerely, Harvey Moses (<— dead giveaway that this is a<br>
>>Â Â Â Â Â fake mail!!)<br>
>><br>
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<br>
--<br>
<br>
Carlos A. Afonso<br>
[emails são pessoais exceto quando explicitamente indicado em contrário]<br>
[emails are personal unless explicitly indicated otherwise]<br>
<br>
Instituto Nupef - <a href="https://nupef.org.br" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://nupef.org.br</a><br>
ISOC-BR - <a href="https://isoc.org.br" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://isoc.org.br</a><br>
<br>
<br>
</blockquote></div></div>